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The Iliad (World's Classics) – tekijä:…
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The Iliad (World's Classics) (vuoden 1984 painos)

– tekijä: Homer

Sarjat: Homer's Epic Cycle (1)

JäseniäKirja-arvostelujaSuosituimmuussijaKeskimääräinen arvioKeskustelut / Maininnat
32,54732856 (4.03)10 / 1434
The centuries old epic about the wrath of Achilles is rendered into modern English verse by a renowned translator and accompanied by an introduction that reassesses the identity of Homer. In Robert Fagles' beautifully rendered text, the Iliad overwhelms us afresh. The huge themes godlike, yet utterly human of savagery and calculation, of destiny defied, of triumph and grief compel our own humanity. Time after time, one pauses and re-reads before continuing. Fagles' voice is always that of a poet and scholar of our own age as he conveys the power of Homer. Robert Fagles and Bernard Knox are to be congratulated and praised on this admirable work.… (lisätietoja)
Jäsen:squirblej
Teoksen nimi:The Iliad (World's Classics)
Kirjailijat:Homer
Info:Oxford Paperbacks (1984), Paperback, 490 pages
Kokoelmat:Oma kirjasto
Arvio (tähdet):
Avainsanoja:-

Teoksen tarkat tiedot

Ilias (tekijä: Homerus (Author))

Viimeisimmät tallentajatOSheaBuffalo, yksityinen kirjasto, dasfuller, GlenRH, bcrosby, MWIlibrary1, SVYC, Admiralcreedy
PerintökirjastotStephenCraneLibrary, JamesMonroe, Charles Macklin, Gillian Rose, José Francisco de San Martín Gómez y Matorras, Edward St. John Gorey , David Robert Jones, Terence Kemp McKenna, William Somerset Maugham, Edna St. Vincent Millay66 lisää, Maria Àngels Anglada d'Abadal, Friedrich Nietzsche, Arthur Ransome, Francis Dana, James Joyce, Robert & Elizabeth Barrett Browning, Harry S Truman, Leonard and Virginia Woolf, Benedictus de Spinoza, Rudyard Kipling, Social Library (1793), Frederick Douglass, William Gaddis, Phillis Wheatley, Myles Standish, Ralph Waldo Emerson, Union College, Oscar Wilde, Hannah Arendt, James Boswell, Leslie Scalapino, Richard Henry Lee, Thomas McKean, Alured Popple, Gustave Flaubert, Fyodor Dostoevsky, Robert Treat Paine, Herman Melville, Samuel Johnson, Thomas Mann, Robert Ranke Graves , Ralph Ellison, Robert Gordon Menzies, Richard Cranch, USS California (Armored Cruiser No. 6), Sylvia Plath, Roger Mifflin, Edward Estlin Cummings , Donald and Mary Hyde, Alexander Pushkin, Landon Carter, Dante Gabriel Rossetti, George Washington, Astrid Lindgren, Thomas Jefferson, George Wythe, Anthony Burgess, Joseph Stevens Buckminster, C. S. Lewis, Franz Kafka, George Washington Mordecai, T. E. Lawrence, James and Mary Murray, Franz Bopp, Eeva-Liisa Manner, Porter Cornelius Bliss, William Butler Yeats, Sir Walter Scott, Charles Lamb, Karen Blixen, John Adams, Walker Percy, Alfred Deakin, Marie Antoinette, Ernest Hemingway, Tim Spalding
  1. 312
    Odysseia (tekijä: Homer) (Voracious_Reader, caflores)
  2. 241
    Aeneis : Aeneaan taru (tekijä: Virgil) (HollyMS)
  3. 91
    Beowulf (tekijä: Beowulf Poet) (benmartin79)
  4. 41
    The Táin (tekijä: Táin author) (inge87)
  5. 31
    Tiger at the Gates (tekijä: Jean Giraudoux) (aulsmith)
    aulsmith: Giraudoux imagines the events in Troy when Paris shows up with Helen
  6. 42
    Ransom (tekijä: David Malouf) (GCPLreader)
  7. 22
    Akhilleen laulu (tekijä: Madeline Miller) (alalba)
  8. 22
    The Dismissal of the Grecian Envoys (tekijä: Jan Kochanowski) (sirparsifal)
  9. 22
    Troy [2004 film] (tekijä: Wolfgang Petersen) (Waldstein)
    Waldstein: Very free interpretation (not adaptation) that in many ways improves on the original. No childish gods, no rambling digressions. Visually spectacular. The dialogue is a bit cringeworthy now and then, but it does have flashes of brilliance. Only for the most broad-minded admirers of Homer - or those who find the Greek bard unsatisfactory. PS Caveat: the Director's Cut is gratuitously gory!… (lisätietoja)
  10. 14
    The Death of King Arthur (tekijä: Unknown) (chrisharpe)
  11. 18
    Labyrinttitaistelu (tekijä: Rick Riordan) (Jitsusama)
    Jitsusama: An ancient classic revolving around Greek Myth. A great help to better understand the mythology of the Percy Jackson and the Olympians series.
Europe (142)
Asia (421)
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Na Grécia antiga, três deusas do Olimpo disputam o título de 'a mais bela'. O mortal troiano Páris é escolhido para decidir a competição. Seu voto vai para Afrodite, que, em retribuição, concede-lhe o direito de ter a mulher mais linda do mundo - Helena, esposa do chefe grego Menelau. Depois de seduzi-la, Páris conduz a amada para Tróia, desencadeando a ira de Menelau. Assim, tem início a guerra mítica entre gregos e troianos. Construída sobre as paixões humanas e divinas, a história tem como pano de fundo o eterno conflito entre o bem e o mal.
  BolideBooks | May 13, 2021 |
The Iliad is the beginning of the Western Canon of imaginative literature, and we know virtually nothing about its author (we know perhaps a scintilla more than we know about whoever authored, say, The Cloud of Unknowing). But perhaps this is a good thing; as William Gaddis's elusive Wyatt Gwyon puts it in The Recognitions, "'What is the artist but the shambles that follows his work around?'" The imagination abounds much more in the lack of information. All we really know is what has come down to us from Herodotus in his Histories, and that the archaic Greek for Homer means "the blind one."

See full review here: http://www.chrisviabookreviews.com/2017/09/07/iliad-c-800-bce/ ( )
  chrisvia | Apr 29, 2021 |
YT video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zvv2W1mLT6w



This is my third pass at the beginning text of Western literature. From Fitzgerald to Fagles, and now to Lattimore, aided with the Greek text from Loeb Library, I've both savored the richness of the Homeric Greek and recoiled at the graphic, violent intensity of its content. In one sense, this is the blueprint for all country music: a man loses his girlfriend, stops working, sulks, and then his best friend dies. In another sense it is a narrative onslaught that foregrounds a panorama of mythological history (for the genesis of which we must turn to Hesiod).

It must be noted that the work represents a much greater complexity than mainstream academia would have us believe. It is not simply what its opening lines tell us; it isn't merely the Muses' account, via Homer, of Achilles' wrath (μῆνῐς) and its destruction. In fact there is very much within the novel that supersedes the wrath, which counterbalances the power of his wrath to transcend even destinies decreed by the immortals (an interesting suspension of the determinism that underpins the whole framework). Like the Torah (or even Milton's retelling of the Pentateuch), it is too simplifying to say that it is a "song" of man's disobedience. After all, there was a great deal of destruction already inherent in the fruit.

Homer has (anachronistically) confirmed Hippocrates's aphorism that life is short but art is long. Over two millennia later, the great lover of books and wine, Clifton Fadiman, placed the Iliad at the start of his [b:The New Lifetime Reading Plan: The Classic Guide to World Literature, Revised and Expanded|249186|The New Lifetime Reading Plan The Classic Guide to World Literature, Revised and Expanded|Clifton Fadiman|https://i.gr-assets.com/images/S/compressed.photo.goodreads.com/books/1388614382l/249186._SY75_.jpg|241449]. Of it and the Odyssey, he says, "They are the first as well as the greatest epics of our civilization"; "Achilles is the first hero in Western literature; and ever since, when we talk of heroic qualities, Achilles is somewhere in the back of our minds..."; "The essential quality of the Iliad is nobility"; and, finally, "All imaginative artists, but only if they are great enough, seem contemporaries [of Homer]." Others have noted some points of intrigue: Richard Jenkyn's, in [b:Classical Literature|24923028|Classical Literature (Pelican Introduction)|Richard Jenkyns|https://i.gr-assets.com/images/S/compressed.photo.goodreads.com/books/1433360946l/24923028._SY75_.jpg|44576605], states, "The Iliad is a story without villains..." and "Homer...has shaped a distinctive picture of the divine." Robert B. Downs, in [b:Books That Changed the World|11630775|Books That Changed the World|Robert Downs|https://s.gr-assets.com/assets/nophoto/book/50x75-a91bf249278a81aabab721ef782c4a74.png|16574333], declared, "...Homer's epic creations...established for all time the greatness of Greek literature." Harold Bloom affirms the greatness in his introduction to his eponymous compendium of critical essays: "The Iliad, except for the Yahwist, Dante, and Shakespeare, is the most extraordinary writing yet to come out of the West...." Simone Weil, a lover of the Iliad, declares force as the true center of the epic, in her monumental essay "The Iliad, or the Poem of Force." And finally: The renowned scholar Alberto Manguel, in his "biography" of Homer's epics, quotes Raymond Queneau: "Every great work of literature is either the Iliad or the Odyssey."

In his remarkable "visual essay," [b:The Infinity of Lists|6695029|The Infinity of Lists|Umberto Eco|https://i.gr-assets.com/images/S/compressed.photo.goodreads.com/books/1327877513l/6695029._SX50_.jpg|6890637], the late Umberto Eco uses the shield of Achilles (from Book XVIII) to describe a closed form. This is because Homer is fully engaged in the whole of his cultural milieu: its social norms and mores, its philosophy, its history (myth), its values. He effortlessly spins his yarn with a nearly complete catalogue of characters both mortal and immortal (and, in Achilles's case, in between). In the event that he needs a little help, the Muses are his Google (but not really, as we know). Homer is in touch with every emotion and in every context, as if he himself has been a warrior, a lover, a peasant, a king, even an enslaved woman toiling at the distaff. The encyclopedic sweep of his efforts died out in the form of epic poetry (Milton is perhaps the swan song of the form, and Poe drove in the nail in his essay "The Poetic Principle"), but it has resurfaced in the last half century or so with books like Pynchon's [b:Gravity's Rainbow|415|Gravity's Rainbow|Thomas Pynchon|https://i.gr-assets.com/images/S/compressed.photo.goodreads.com/books/1414969925l/415._SY75_.jpg|866393] and David Foster Wallace's [b:Infinite Jest|6759|Infinite Jest|David Foster Wallace|https://i.gr-assets.com/images/S/compressed.photo.goodreads.com/books/1446876799l/6759._SY75_.jpg|3271542]. The impulse to distill the whole of life, to trap within amber the collective consciousness of an era, has had conflagrations in Europe and the Americas ([a:Bolaño Roberto|14135660|Bolano, Roberto|https://s.gr-assets.com/assets/nophoto/user/u_50x66-632230dc9882b4352d753eedf9396530.png] being a chief example from South America), as expertly traced out in [b:The Maximalist Novel: From Thomas Pynchon's Gravity's Rainbow to Roberto Bolano's 2666|18402956|The Maximalist Novel From Thomas Pynchon's Gravity's Rainbow to Roberto Bolano's 2666|Stefano Ercolino|https://i.gr-assets.com/images/S/compressed.photo.goodreads.com/books/1408916375l/18402956._SY75_.jpg|26036104]. In a real sense, Homer's epics, supplemented with Hesiod on one side of history and the Greek tragedians on the other, was the bible (biblion) for the Greek peoples. So much so, that, even in the days of the early Christian church, we see the people reacting to Paul and Barnabas like characters out of Homer:

And when the crowds saw what Paul had done, they lifted up their voices, saying in Lycaonian, “The gods have come down to us in the likeness of men!” Barnabas they called Zeus, and Paul, Hermes, because he was the chief speaker. And the priest of Zeus, whose temple was at the entrance to the city, brought oxen and garlands to the gates and wanted to offer sacrifice with the crowds. (Acts 14:11-13, ESV)

One of the major focuses of the text is that of honor and nobility, what makes a man's life glorious. In the Iliad the answer appears to be found through the fire of warfare. In other words, the greatest warrior is the most noble person. Achilles on the Achaian side and Hektor on the Torjan side represent the ideals of ancient Greek eugenics. They are great and respected because they are powerful in battle. The intellect is represented in Odysseus and Nestor, but, in the heat of a skirmish, intellect is suspended in favor of blood lust. It is ironic, then, that Helen should be the epicenter of the ten-year ware. Like Achilles, her stage time is minimal. Homer does not litter the narratives of the battles with reminders of Helen as the object of the opposition. Though this started the war, it recedes to the background and the two-layer chess match--a dramatic, soap opera-like interweaving of mortals and immortals and their respective power politics--takes precedence.

A feminist reading must be mentioned. Yes, to a large degree, Homer's epics cast women in a light that is far less than savory. Brisies, for example, and Helen herself, can definitely be chalked up to nothing more than war booty (forgive the pun). Yet, we also cannot bury our heads in the sand and deny (or rewrite) history. To take Weil's perspective, this is a culture of force: force, aggression, violence wins. Unfortunately for women of the time, this is apparently the recipe for happiness in a Greek man: "when a man has been well filled with wine and with eating / and then does battle all day long against the enemy, / why, then the heart inside him is full of cheer...." No mention of sex! Notice, too, how Aphrodite acts to bring Helen and Paris to bed together in Book III; and how Hera colludes with Aphrodite (among others) to bed/distract Zeus in Book XIV (I also cannot help but note here how Zeus prefaces their intimate encounter with a list of all his philandering--how foreign to our sentiments!). I'm afraid that the sexual politics here, and especially in terms of gender, are a bit more complex than an immature reading of the narrative yields. I will avoid the concept of willingness, because I don't think we can debate that with the mindset of a Homer or contemporary; we can only approach this with damaging revisionist presentism. I will, instead, end this shaky discussion of gender with a thought I had: With such vivid, visceral details of violence, why is there such reticence when it comes to sex? When it comes to warfare, we get this level of detail:

This man Peneleos caught underneath the brow, at the bases
of the eye, and pushed the eyeball out, and the spear went clean through
the eye-socket and tendon of the neck, so that he went down
backward, reaching out both hands, but Peneleos drawing
his sharp sword hewed at the neck in the middle, and so dashed downward
the head, with helm upon it, while still on the point of the big spear
the eyeball stuck.
(Book XIV, 493-499)

Oh, my Zeus! But when it comes to sex, the most detail we get is they "lay in love" or Paris's invitation to Helen to "go to bed and turn to lovemaking." One is tempted to reason that, given a culture devoid of Judeo-Christian morals, for example, such blatant omission of sexual conquest seems unexpected. When we think of ancient Greek and Trojan warriors, we think of primitive brutes plundering cities and ravaging women. Yet we only see one side of this in the authoritative reporter of the culture. In an aesthetic sense, it is historically very difficult to describe sex in writing without the narrative collapsing (not everyone is an Ovid). This has led to such treasures as Literary Review's annual Bad Sex in Fiction award. But I hesitate to think that Homer had this in mind. I am left to take a clue from Helen's expression of embarrassment when Zeus wants to have sex with her on high where all the others can see (to be sure, he doesn't choose this deliberately; he is just urgent under her spell), and Zeus's acquiescence and gesture to wrap them in a golden cloud. Like most preconceptions we have of Homer, I think a closer reading will lead to a deeper view of what is really being said (or not said). This is not to excuse WASPy values; only to rescue a great work from sophomoric thin-slicing.

In the end, I am more of a Longinian reader. That is, I hunt for the Sublime in literature above the fracturing avenues of literary theory (O, how I wish I could pursue my master's degree over again!). For me, the most sublime moment comes in Book IX. This book is a close formal relative of the [b:The Book of Job|82241|The Book of Job|Anonymous|https://i.gr-assets.com/images/S/compressed.photo.goodreads.com/books/1388468757l/82241._SY75_.jpg|79413], in that three friends of Achilles take turns trying to counsel and sway him in the midst of his lowest season in life (though Job's is admittedly worse). In this midst of these speeches and Achilles's rejoinders, we get this:

I carry two sorts of destiny toward the day of my death. Either
if I stay here and fight beside the city of the Trojans,
my return home is gone, but my glory shall be everlasting;
but if I return home to the beloved land of my fathers,
the excellence of my glory is gone, but there will be a long life
left for me, and my end in death will not come to me quickly.
(Book IX, 411-416)

The threat of death looms over Achilles because he is doomed to a short life. Here we get a peak into the genius of Greek mythology: the man who has the ability of great speed therefore rushes through life and meets death quickly. And now he is in a dilemma that forces him to choose long life or greatness. Going back to Hippocrates's aphorism, I think we all want to achieve and leave behind some form of glory in life, but we also want a long satisfying life in which to achieve it. The Iliad, then, is a long consideration of this sublime would-you-rather question. That is but one challenge we, as readers, must bring to the text. ( )
  chrisvia | Apr 29, 2021 |
Well, I am happy to say that I have finally read the Iliad. This was my first Greek poem and I have to say, I thoroughly enjoyed it. The story flows well and it kept me on edge all the whole way through.

I wasn't familiar with the Trojan War and how it came to be. Imagine my surprise when I read it was all due to a squabble over a woman named Helen. The war rages on in the span of 10 years! A LOT of dudes die over this. Helen must've been one hell of a lady.

The scenes where the soldiers engage in combat were graphic. The Greeks certainly loved their violence! Homer doesn't hold back his descriptions of the battles; head getting lopped off, men trying to hold in their innards from spilling and spears being inserted violently into necks.

I found the monologues that two soldiers would have in the midst of battle before they killed one another hilarious. Imagine two guys with swords in hand engaging in conversation in the midst of bloody chaos. The Greeks were very much about honor and were proud to boast about where they came from and who their father was. This they would shout to the other man before fighting to the death. Removing the armor of the loser was also a popular tradition. I found this fascinating.

Oh, and the Gods? Zeus? Apollo? Poseidon? All of them squabble like children. They cry and beg and want to only interfere in the war, choosing sides and helping a soldier from Troy or helping one out from the Greeks. They would sit back from the comfort of Olympus and watch the battle wage on. It was as if they were playing a game of chess only with human lives hanging in the balance.

I was told to read The Iliad before jumping into The Odyssey and I'm glad I did.

Overall I enjoyed the story and I'm happy I leapt into the world of Greek poetry! ( )
1 ääni ProfessorEX | Apr 15, 2021 |
Favorite quote: (this is not an actual quote from the Iliad but from The Triumph Of Achilles by Louise Gluck and I like it a lot)

"In his tent, Achilles grieved with his whole being, and the gods saw he was a man already dead, a victim of the part that loved, the part that was mortal."

It is really hard for me rate my reading experience of The Iliad: there were exciting parts I absolutely loved and would give billions of stars, like Andromache's speeches in book VI and book XVI (actually both left me in tears... I have a lot of feels for Andromache and Hector okay?), Ajax/Hector duel, Achilles after Patroclus' death, Achilles/Hector death match, Priam asking Achilles for the body... however I was bored out of my mind during numerous parts of the book and I realized only later that I could just as easily skip those passages (I'm looking at you Catalog of Ships), the depiction of those scenes were just sleep-inducing. Oh also, it is very important to have an extended knowledge of the Greek/Roman mythology heroes and creatures and gods and goddesses and kings and princes, or else you'll be completely lost.

It could not be described as bad though; Homer is world-class literature, not going to argue with that, the Iliad is entertaining, sexy, funny with multi-dimensional backstabbing nasty and mean characters I loved to hate and fantastic gory fight scenes; for someone who's planning to read the Iliad for the first time, I think it'd be easier for you to take all your sweet time to do it; as far as I can tell, the ancient world used to recite the poetry in bits and pieces as entertainment in fancy parties so it is clearly not meant to be read in one-sitting and only once in your lifetime.

I wish I could take a class to study Homeric works and Latin translations to grasp the whole essence of such an epic tragedy...

Next: THE ODYSSEUS!
1 ääni Ash600 | Mar 19, 2021 |
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Katso lisäohjeita Common Knowledge -sivuilta (englanniksi).
Kanoninen teoksen nimi
Alkuteoksen nimi
Teoksen muut nimet
Alkuperäinen julkaisuvuosi
Henkilöt/hahmot
Tiedot englanninkielisestä Yhteisestä tiedosta. Muokkaa kotoistaaksesi se omalle kielellesi.
Tärkeät paikat
Tärkeät tapahtumat
Tiedot englanninkielisestä Yhteisestä tiedosta. Muokkaa kotoistaaksesi se omalle kielellesi.
Kirjaan liittyvät elokuvat
Palkinnot ja kunnianosoitukset
Tiedot englanninkielisestä Yhteisestä tiedosta. Muokkaa kotoistaaksesi se omalle kielellesi.
Epigrafi (motto tai mietelause kirjan alussa)
Omistuskirjoitus
Ensimmäiset sanat
Laulaos, oi runotar, viha Peleun poian Akhilleun
turmiokas, mi akhaijeja löi lukemattomin tuskin,
monta mi Hadeen luo väkivoipaa sielua syöksi
sankarien, heist' itsestään teki koirien riistan,
lintujen eineen – Zeun sepä täyttihe neuvo ja päätös,
kerta kun ensistään sopurikkoon Atreun poika,
miesten valtias, riitautui sekä aimo Akhilleus.
Sitaatit
Tiedot englanninkielisestä Yhteisestä tiedosta. Muokkaa kotoistaaksesi se omalle kielellesi.
And Zeus said: “Hera, you can choose some other time for paying your visit to Oceanus — for the present let us devote ourselves to love and to the enjoyment of one another. Never yet have I been so overpowered by passion neither for goddess nor mortal woman as I am at this moment for yourself — not even when I was in love with the wife of Ixion who bore me Pirithoüs, peer of gods in counsel, nor yet with Danaë, the daintly ankled daughter of Acrisius, who bore me the famed hero Perseus. Then there was the daughter of Phonenix, who bore me Minos and Rhadamanthus. There was Semele, and Alcmena in Thebes by whom I begot my lion-hearted son Heracles, while Samele became mother to Bacchus, the comforter of mankind. There was queen Demeter again, and lovely Leto, and yourself — but with none of these was I ever so much enamored as I now am with you.”
Viimeiset sanat
(Napsauta nähdäksesi. Varoitus: voi sisältää juonipaljastuksia)
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Canonical DDC/MDS
The centuries old epic about the wrath of Achilles is rendered into modern English verse by a renowned translator and accompanied by an introduction that reassesses the identity of Homer. In Robert Fagles' beautifully rendered text, the Iliad overwhelms us afresh. The huge themes godlike, yet utterly human of savagery and calculation, of destiny defied, of triumph and grief compel our own humanity. Time after time, one pauses and re-reads before continuing. Fagles' voice is always that of a poet and scholar of our own age as he conveys the power of Homer. Robert Fagles and Bernard Knox are to be congratulated and praised on this admirable work.

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Kirjan kuvailu
Yhteenveto haiku-muodossa

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Arvio (tähdet)

Keskiarvo: (4.03)
0.5 3
1 55
1.5 15
2 215
2.5 32
3 838
3.5 150
4 1384
4.5 164
5 1645

Penguin Australia

Penguin Australia on kustantanut tämän kirjan 5 painosta.

Painokset: 0140275363, 0140445927, 0140447946, 0140444440, 0451530691

HighBridge Audio

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